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In order to keep up with the nature of free, spirited debate, I wanted to place the chat feature at the top of the homepage. This ensures people can come here and share their views on anything they wish and not have it be related to any specific discussion. Here, people can share ideas, links, and views "unmoderated" and an their own pace. To me, this makes The Elephant in the Room blog truly a place for debate.

Thursday, September 20, 2012

Barack Obama Logo on American Flag Mock-Up - Is This Going Too Far?

What do you think of the following item being sold at ( - Please vote using the buttons below. Instructions are in this post - click "Read More"

(Click the image for an expanded view)

For me personally, these kind of things don't really bother me. I don't get upset at materials. When I see the Ten Commandments on a courthouse, or a cross on government property, or protesters burning the American Flag (I know many people do get upset by this), it doesn't phase me. It's not because I'm not patriotic: I'd just rather default to freedom and letting people do what they please, and most importantly, I'd rather stick to more relevant issues that truly have an effect on our country's well-being. Keep in mind, all this is coming from a person who served in the Navy for four years.

I can absolutely, however, see how people would be bothered by these kind of things, and I can certainly see how people would be upset at the Obama campaign selling the item above. I can also see how, after accusing the Romney campaign of being "divisive," this flag would send a divisive message. It's not the American flag at all, and no one is claiming it is... but the representation it gives and the insinuation it implies is pretty deep. The message, in my opinion, is, "this is OUR country... this is OUR flag." Obviously, to the non-Obama supporters out there, this would be divisive.

Most importantly, what do you think? Let's take a vote. Please use the voting buttons below this post to share your views:

If you find this offensive, use the "strongly agree" - "agree" buttons.
If you do not find this offensive, use the "disagree" - "strongly disagree" buttons.
If you have no opinion, use the "neutral" button.

Thank you.


  1. This should really be the last straw for many. Even democrats can agree this is pretty bad.

  2. Thank you, LME, for making me puke in my mouth :)

  3. This is not the flag me and my friends swore to defend. This is not the flag I pledge allegiance to. This is a disgrace. I can't believe our president would be so brazen to sell this insulting horseshit on his website.

  4. President 0bama has so much disdain for America this doesn't even come as a surprise to me. He is a very disrespectful person why on earth would we expect this low class narcissist to respect our flag.

    I am one of those people that can't stand to see my American flag burning/disrespected. It grieves my heart. I saw a story that warmed my heart the other day. A Pakistani protestor was burning my American flag in Pakistan and later died from inhaling the fumes. Old Glory strikes back. LOL

    0bama didn't wear a flag pin for the longest time in the Democrat primaries in 2008. All of the sudden he started wearing one. They must have done some polling or something.

    I recall another instance where (again, during the primaries in 2008) all the Dem candidates were doing the pledge of allegiance (maybe the National Anthem, I forget which) and had their hands over their heart while 0bama stood their twiddling his thumbs.

    I also recall another instance where Michelle 0bama leaned over to Barak and said, "All this over a damn flag".

    So, like I said, it comes as absolutely no surprise at all that he further shows his contempt for everything American.

    1. @Slim - I'm sorry, I know it was wrong, but I laughed out loud at the poetic justice of the guy who died from smoke inhalation - while burning OUR flag. He'll have to meet his 42 virgins a bit scorched...

      Two photos of 0 NEITHER saluting NOR placing his hand properly over his heart during official ceremonies involving OUR flag (or OUR Anthem)

  5. I suppose my question would be, regarding this:

    “It's not the American flag at all, and no one is claiming it is... but the representation it gives and the insinuation it implies is pretty deep. The message, in my opinion, is, "this is OUR country... this is OUR flag." Obviously, to the non-Obama supporters out there, this would be divisive.”

    If the Obama campaign referring to America as “our country” is divisive, do you also view Romney’s campaign saying “we need to take our country back!” as the same?

    1. Well as long as we are going to go along the "gotcha" line of questioning, I guess my question would be; aren't politics "divisive" in general?

    2. Yes, politics are divisive. That's more or less what I was pointing out.

      Particularly in this past election.

  6. This has to be the dumbest comparison I've ever seen. You're comparing a divisive, disgusting, slap in America's face slander of the American flag to a phrase like "take our country back????" That's like saying, "Obama plays basketball, so what do you think of Mitt Romney liking oranges?"

    The fact is how dare he put his personal logo on the flag! That's America's flag. This is America's nation. He works for us. We are not under him. We are not under HIS flag. This is horrendous in what it implies. And as per usual, all my leftie facebook friends are saying "it's not the flag, cool down."

    Are you serious?! This is a total mockery of what we stand for. We are not a country governed by a king, we should not have to live under his flag. If he wants to parade that stupid O, his shield, around. Fine. But a flag, especially one that mocks Old Glory is completely reprehensible.

    1. A little worked up there, are we?

      Slow down, breath, and look at what I said a little more closely. :) In the quote I was addressing, the issue taken with this topic by LME was (at least in part) the implication of "OUR country" by Obama's campaign. Is it not? That's more or less the exact quote I referred to, and rather clearly.

      Considering that, my question was if the same belief was carried over to Mitt Romney openly campaigning on “taking our country back.” Does this not imply the same type of divisive ‘rightful possession’ of a political party over the country?

  7. WOW!!! Are you people f*&%ing crazy?!?!?! It's not the flag, it's a design based on the flag. He is the President (and even if he wasn't, who cares?). You can look at my icon in the 'Followers' section on the rights side of this page... is my icon offensive? It too is based on the American flag. I hope that you peole are saying what you're saying solely because you dislike Obama. If not, it goes to show that this sampling of R's is anti freedom of speech. I agree with LME in that I don't care but, unlike LME, I can't even see a remote reason why anyone would be offended by this... IN THE LAND OF THE FREE!!! I think the design is neat.. I wouldn't buy one but I do like it. Most of you know how I feel about religion yet I don't find this ridiculousness offensive (, do you? For those offended by the above, your answer must unequivocally be 'yes' right? Anything that resembles the flag that isn't the flag is offensive, yes? If you don't find it offensive, I'd love to hear your take (also, I understand that it is possible to find something offensive but still support the right of someone to do it - by example, I find religion offensive but I'd die for religions to be able to freely practice). Is that the case? Hating on Obama but supportive of the overall usage?

    Lastly, LME... Give me a break with that interpretation! It's a knock off of the American flag... he is the President and is running for a 2nd term. During elections the candidates want to seem more patriotic than the other. The American flag is a pretty good symbol of patriotism, no? And, if you do, REALLY, interpret it that way, how do you feel about the question RKen put out there?

    Slim - Politics are about expressing differing opinions and allowing the public to choose which ideas they think are better. Ideally, after the election, people accept the results rather than grow angry about it. The idea of politics is not necessarily to be divisive, it's a byproduct of the way our dysfunctional 'leaders' operate. It is amazing that someone who claims to love the flag as much as you do hates the ability of people to use the flag for expression. That sort of freedom is the foundation for this country. I don't know how you can love the flag and hate what it represents (as it seems you do). The actual flag, in my opinion, does not exist in physical form. It is an idea and a representation. Nothing can ever be done to my flag. It cannot be mistreated and it cannot be destroyed. My flag was not made in a sweatshop... Slim - would you find the same love for the flag if it was made in a sweatshop exploiting workers? Say it was made in the Marianas Islands where sweatshops produce things under the Made in USA banner, do you still have love for that flag?

  8. Awwww poor little whatsa. He is getting upset- he insulted his lord and master. He is in a huffy puff. How ridiculous. In all honesty, I don't see how you can jump on LME he really had the same view as you. Calm down, take a break, stop with this pseudo freedom shit, get you lips off Obama's ass and relax in reality please

    1. Anna -

      Stop stealing RKen's lines. I do tend to get upset when people trample on freedom. I don't expect you to understand.

  9. Where on here is anyone promoting "trampling on freedom" show it... Or just admit you over reacted. Calm down

  10. Anna -

    "This should really be the last straw for many"; "This is a disgrace. I can't believe our president would be so brazen to sell this insulting horseshit on his website."; "He is a very disrespectful person why on earth would we expect this low class narcissist to respect our flag. "But a flag, especially one that mocks Old Glory is completely reprehensible."... Not one person said 'i find it distatseful but think he has every right to use the logo'.

    I would admit if I overreacted, IF I overreacted which I didn't. I find what those above said to be disgraceful, especially the WarVetNOBAMA comment. Assuming that this guy is talking about miitary service, he didn't swear to uphold the physical flag, he swore to uphold the idea and now he appears to be stating that what he swore to uphold he finds disgraceful. Not one person mentioned that they support his right to use the logo. If I am misinterpreting than I will admit I'm wrong but the words I am seeing lead me to believe the intent is anything that resembles the flag that isn't is a mockery of the flag and is disgraceful. We'll agree to disagree if that's not how you see it.

    So, Anna, what is your position on the Obama logo? And by the way, making affirmative erroneous statements about me really takes away from any credibility you may have unless of course you can 'show it or just admit you're wrong'.

    1. Let's try this again. Where in this thread did anyone say anything that even comes close to wanting to restrict freedom? Where? You conveniently avoided that question. Not a single person here recommended that. Not a single person said anything remotely close. You most definitely overreacted.

      Didn't swear to uphold the physical flag? Duh! He swore to uphold the metaphysical "flag" - not override it with his personal logo.

      I think you are misinterpreting what people are saying. "Not one person mentioned that they support his right to use the logo" um hello, LME did. Did you not read this post before you ripped in to him with your "give me a break" rant? He clearly said "It's not because I'm not patriotic: I'd just rather default to freedom and letting people do what they please,"

      As far as my position of the Obama logo? I hate it. I want to rip it apart. I loathe the man it stands for, and it's an absolute killer pang to me that I have to see it on a 9-striped abomination that resembles the flag I love so dearly. Would I say that he shouldn't be permitted to do it. Absolutely not. Never. It's his right. To me, it's a disgrace, and I can disagree with it, but I would never, and I don't think anyone here would ever propose we create a gov't so strong that it limits freedom of expression no matter how detestable it is. Does that answer your question?

      Honestly, I've joked about it before, but in all sincerely, for a group of people who come here and enjoy respectful debate, your "are you so crazy" rant (I'm sure you're passionate) about it, but just because someone has a difference of opinion doesn't mean they have a mental condition, warrants an apology <3

    2. Anna -

      If you don't read what I read than we'll agree to disagree. There's no point in me trying to explain something to you that you can't or won't understand. People have written what they've written. I would imagine we're all big boys/girls and if they wanted to correct my interpretation of what they've written (and, believe me, I wish they would) they can do that.

      Override the flag??? What does that even mean? Sure, it resembles the flar but has fewer stripes and no starts. If Obama did that, hell, we should probably bomb Malasia and Liberia... Liberia even has a star in their blue area. Let's go get those overriders!!!!

      I do agree with you on one point, I do owe LME an apology. You made me go back and read what I wrote and I thought I wrote my agreement with him in his overall concept. I didn't and I should have. I was simply calling him out on his witch hunt interpretation and I think he is big boy enough to handle that. Though I do wish I had been more clear (or clear at all).

      Glad to hear, Anna, that you support his right to use the likeness. Do you feel that my icon is offensive in the same way as Obama's logo? How about the christian one that actually uses the 13 stripes but with a cross, do you want to "rip it apart"?

  11. This is NOT the first time 0 has defaced OUR flag. His 'people' put HIS face on OUR flag back in (March?). Now his 'people' have 'redesigned' OUR flag with five oddly colored stripes and HIS logo.

    OUR flag is a symbol of OUR country - of We The People... Patriots have FOUGHT AND DIED to protect and defend OUR flag.

    @Whatsamatta Just because the Supreme Court upheld the First Amendment right of free expression for MORONS who defile and deface OUR flag... does NOT make it RIGHT. I find it PARTICULARLY HEINOUS when the PRESIDENT, who's SUPPOSED to be for ALL of us does something so CRASS and DISGUSTING... in the name of 'free speech.' IMO that makes him NO better than the anti-American JERKS and PINHEADS who burn, trample, defecate or otherwise dishonor OUR flag.

    But, I guess I shouldn't be surprised...

  12. Dara -

    How has 'O' defaced our flag exactly? Did Malaysia and/or Liberia and the christian flag I posted and I, myself, redesign the flag?

    I don't know who 'OUR' is and I guess I don't know who 'We The People' are... I always thought I was one of them but, by your definition I guess I'm not.

    Patriots have fought to defend the idea of a flag... what it stands for. They didn't fight for a 10 stripe flag with an O on it. Nor did they fight for my logo (well, in a way they did) nor Malaysia nor Liberia. They fought for what the flag stands for. The freedom to use the likeness of the flag as one sees fit. Whether it be to encase it in glass or wipe their ass with it. Would you treat and al-Qaeda flag or Palestinian flag with respect? They all mean something deep to people.

    Actually, what SCOTUS did does make right.. as in a civil right (which I would expect you, a self described Constitutional conservative, to understand) which you've already shown disdain for as it relates to gay rights (which shocks me as someone who supposedly believes in the Constitution). I know whay you mean by 'right' and I agree with you but who cares. So, did Larry Flynt defile the flag when he wore it as a diaper or did he make a statement and, is he a 'moron'? By the way, you know OUR flag has 13 stripes and stars right??? O's doesn't. So I'll ask you what I've asked everyone... Are my logo, the Malaysian flag, the Liberian flag, and the christian flag I linked to all the same as what you've accused O's of being. If not, can you help me understand?

    In my opinion, to be so easily offended as by something like the O logo is akin to being the kid in school who starts a fight because someone tells them they're mom looks funny. It's immature at worst and a ghost hunt for an us against them position at best.

    1. @Whatsamatta - Malaysia? Libya? Where did that come from? ANY defacement of the American flag is not acceptable, no matter WHO does it. Your 'logo' does not deface the flag - it's a stylization of OUR nation's symbol... I feel sorry for you if defacement WAS your intent... maybe you could change it to 0's 'flag'?

      It is NOT an 'idea of a flag' - it's the SYMBOL of OUR nation. I would NOT treat a flag of ANY nation with disrespect. The Supreme Ct. upheld the right for anti-American MORONS to deface, defile and disrespect our flag... just because something is 'legal' - does NOT make it right... Larry Flynt IS a moron, and YES he DID defile the flag... and SO DID 0.

      'disdain for 'gay' rights?' Wrong! I could care less what consenting adults do... I support traditional marriage, which the Constitution DOES NOT address one way or the other. The 'gay marriage' issue belongs with the STATES. Oh SNAP - 39 STATES have VOTED by MAJORITY that they DO NOT want it... want to marry your same sex partner? Vote with your feet and move to a state that condones it.

      You're entitled to you opinion. Since the REVOLUTIONARY WAR, my family has fought and DIED for OUR flag. I have two grandsons and a godson in the service TODAY - placing THEMSELVES in HARMS WAY for OUR flag AND THIS COUNTRY. They fight for ALL of us, no matter WHAT their political affiliation under the colors of OUR 'Old Glory'... 0 bastardized OUR flag - in a pathetic attempt to 'forward' his agenda.

      My opinion: This PIG of a 'president' has disrespected not only THEM, but the millions who have fought and died before them to protect and defend the UNITED States of America - and her FLAG.

    2. Why would my intent to be to deface the flag? The Malaysian and Liberian flags are almost identical to ours, that's where that came from. The christians used EXACTLY the US flag but instead of stars put a cross.. thoughts on that? I'll ask again, how did O deface our flag? He did not use the US flag, he used somthing that would invoke the feeling of it... Just like I did, just like the christians did (I doubt Malaysia and Liberia had that intent). I don't understand how my logo is fine and O's logo is not. They're essentially the same thing.

      It is the idea of the flag AS a symbol of our nation. The actual, physical flag means nothing. Does a flag made in China still hold value? Not to me. Does a flag made by children in a sweatshop in the Marianas Islands under the banner "Made in the US" have value? Not to me it doesn't. It's the idea that's to be protected. Again, to view it any other way is akin to getting ticked off because someone says your mom looks funny... Quite childish.

      As a Constitutional conservative I would think that you would understand that the Constitution prevents the government from allowing one group of people to do something and not another. Most states do not allow same sex couples to marry/civilly unionize/whatever, I'll call it marriage for simplicity. That is discrimination. Oh snap - do you think the states in the South would have given blacks rights in a democratic vote? No so stop with your 39 states bs. It is also a reason that this country is a republic and not a democracy. Since I am not gat and am married happily to wife for nearly 11 years, I'm good. I'm just for equality.. FOR ALL. It's sad though that you can admit you're against civil rights on some level.

      Thanks to your family!

      Name one battle that was fought defending the flag.

    3. I'll say it again - this is NOT about anyone's interpretation of what is or is not a 'civil right' - It's about RIGHT AND WRONG...

      just because a thing is legal does not make it RIGHT. What Obama did was as WRONG as Flynt or the OWSer who pooped on OUR flag...

      Worse b/c he's supposed to be the President of the United States and he's supposed to HOLD HIMSELF to the HIGHEST standard.

      I wonder how the left would have reacted had GWBush or ANY R would have lowered themselves to the same repulsive act of desecration... my guess? my voice would have been DROWNED OUT BY THEIR OUTRAGE.

      Marriage is NOT a 'civil right' ALL the 'rules' surrounding it are STATE controlled. It is NOT mentioned anywhere in the Constitution - it IS a STATE concern. Marriage is ONE man and ONE woman... If they WERE NOT intent on shoving their lifestyle down MY throat, they'd CALL their unions...SOMETHING OTHER THAN MARRIAGE ~

      FYI It was the REBUBLICANS who voted UNANIMOUSLY to grant civil rights to the blacks. The DEMS voted UNANIMOUSLY NAY.

      Oh, and congrats on your marriage. 42 years here : ) and still going strong!

  13. Hahaha, I haven't been on this site for a while.
    Same 5 crazy, angry nutjobs trying their best to convince eachother of the ridiculous spin and lies Fox news skeets in the publics face.

    Seriously ..... Only 5 commenters here.


    1. You actually look pretty dumb here. I'm a democrat, but I come here mainly as a reader to see what other people say. I like that everyone here, both left and right, gives the reasons for their arguments instead of doing what youre doing. I might not agree with what is said, but I respect the opinions of others. People like you are the reason this country is in the shape its in. For what purpose do you even say somethign like that? What good does that do? Do you want power? Does it feel nice? HOnestly, your comment is one of the few ridiculous ones here.

      "trying to convince eachother of the ridiculous spin and lies Fox News skeets."

      What are you referring to? What lies. As a democrat, like I said, I might not agree with what is said here, but it's truthful. Again, youre about to look really, really ignorant, but can you actually show what lies there are? In fact, I'm quite tired of the "stop watching Fox news" reply. It seems that that's what people on our side do when we have no intelligent counterpoint. I hate it, and I think it makes us look bad. Could you even show us what Fox news does to lie? It seems to me that youre just repeating the Koolaid backed drivel you hear by other mindless democrats.

      Lets be the party of intelligence. Lets be the party of civility. You show neither, and though you might be anti-republican, there is no way I or many like me on the left could stand with you. Take a hike. Enjoy life in a clouded world of ignorance.

    2. LOL well said, Laura!

    3. Thanks Laura : )

      You Annonymi shout 'Fox lies!' but when challenged, can not cite ONE example.